Home > Recount efforts in Ohio by Kerry intensify

Recount efforts in Ohio by Kerry intensify

by Open-Publishing - Tuesday 23 November 2004
32 comments

Elections-Elected USA

by Adam Stone

A top-ranking official with Democratic Senator John Kerry’s presidential campaign told North County News last week that although unlikely, there is a recount effort being waged that could unseat Republican President George W. Bush.

"We have 17,000 lawyers working on this, and the grassroots accountability couldn’t be any higher -no (irregularity) will go unchecked. Period," Kerry spokesman David Wade said.

A verbal firestorm erupted last week between an area supporter of independent presidential candidate Ralph Nader and Wade after the Kerry spokesman derided Nader for creating a "phony wedge issue between progressives."

Nader has been calling on Kerry and his vice presidential running mate, Senator John Edwards of North Carolina, to, in his words, "follow through on their post-election promise to the American people to make sure every vote counts, starting in Ohio."

A Kerry victory in Ohio means he would have the necessary electoral votes to take the White House.

The local Nader supporter, Don DeBar, an Ossining resident, took umbrage with Wade’s remarks.

"It seems to me the (wedge) was created when Kerry, after promising to ensure that every vote would count, conceded before they were counted," DeBar, who worked for the Nader campaign in San Antonio during the ballot access drive, wrote in an e-mail message to Wade.

The Kerry spokesman said, so far, "there hasn’t been any indication" of swinging a state or the overall election.

"...But we’ll make sure every single vote is counted," he added.

Nader press secretary Kevin Zeese said "I’m laughing," after being informed of Wade’s remark about creating a wedge issue.

"They used those same 17,000 lawyers to keep us off the ballots," Zeese said during a telephone interview.

Wade said Nader "should be working with Democrats to guarantee the right to vote is protected."

During a flurry of e-mail exchanges with Wade, DeBar said, "What about the concession? If there are sufficient indicia of fraud and/or inaccurate counting, will Kerry ’unconcede’?"

Former Vice President Al Gore conceded in his 2000 battle with Bush for the White House before demanding recounts, which were ultimately halted by the United States Supreme Court.

Two third-party presidential candidates have raised enough money to file for an official recount of the vote in Ohio.

Green Party candidate David Cobb announced Monday the $113,600 needed to file for a recount had been raised.

"Thanks to the thousands of people who have contributed to this effort, we can say with certainty that there will be a recount in Ohio," Cobb said in a statement.

The Green Party has been working with the Libertarian Party - both parties were on the ballot in Ohio - in securing a recount. Both Cobb and Libertarian Michael Badnarik say they’ve demanded that Ohio Secretary of State Kenneth Blackwell, a Republican who co-chaired this year’s Bush campaign in Ohio, recuse himself from the recount process.

Cobb Media Director Blair Bobier said, "The Ohio presidential election was marred by numerous press and independent reports of mismarked and discarded ballots, problems with electronic voting machines and the targeted disenfranchisement of African-American voters."

The Ohio vote will be certified on Dec. 3 at the latest, Bobier said.

The Electoral College votes on December 13, so it is unclear whether or not a recount would be completed by then.

However, Jonathan Turley, a professor of constitutional law at George Washington University, told WorldNetDaily.com that "those votes are not opened by Congress until Jan. 6. So there is still time to challenge the results in Ohio."

A demand for a recount in Ohio can only be filed by a presidential candidate who was either a certified write-in candidate or on the ballot in that state.

Bush won Ohio by a vote of 2,796,147 to John Kerry’s 2,659,664. Despite reports of irregularities and outstanding provisional ballots, Kerry conceded Ohio and the election on November 3.

In the 11 Ohio counties that have finished checking provisional ballots cast in the presidential election, 81 percent have turned out to be valid. It is too early to know whether the ballots have benefited Bush or Kerry because counties first need to determine their validity before conducting the count.

Badnarik received 14,331 votes in Ohio and Cobb, as a write-in candidate, received 24 votes.

When asked about how the Kerry campaign has reacted to Nader’s efforts, Zeese said, "You’ve got the closest thing to a response," referring to the comments made by Wade to North County News.

According to a November 5 article by the Associated Press, elections officials admitted that an error with an electronic voting system gave President Bush 3,893 extra votes in a Gahanna precinct. Franklin County reported Bush with 4,258 votes and John Kerry with 260, even though only 638 voters cast ballots in that precinct. Election officials in that county now say a cartridge from a voting machine generated errors after the precinct closed, and only 365 people voted for Bush, Nader notes in a press release.

Additional machine errors in Ohio reported by VotersUnite.org, include:

• Mahoning County: The glass on top of one electronic screen was too far from the screen, making it difficult for people to use their fingers to cast ballots. A screen went blank on a Youngstown voter while he cast his ballot.

• Mahoning County: 20 to 30 machines needed to be recalibrated during the voting process because some votes for a candidate were being counted for that candidate’s opponent.

• Mahoning County: About a dozen machines needed to be reset because they essentially froze.

• Cincinnati: Problems with punch card voting machines delayed the start of voting for up to an hour Tuesday morning at a suburban precinct. Voters were unable to slide their punch-card ballots all the way into any of the six voting machines that had all evidently been damaged in transit.

• Columbus: Overcharged batteries on Danaher Controls ELECTronic 1242 systems kept machines from booting up properly at the beginning of the day.

The resulting delays, combined with higher voter turnout, resulted in lines of several hours, in one case 22 hours, and led to some citizens’ voting rights being taken away by administrative default, Nader contends.

The situation in Ohio and other states bears out, according to Nader, what he warned against before the election.

Among them:

Computers are inherently subject to programming error, equipment malfunction and malicious tampering.

Paperless electronic voting machines make it impossible to safeguard the integrity of the vote.

"However, the Democratic National Committee has remained silent on the issue since Election Day," Nader’s press release states. "Neither the DNC web site nor the Ohio Democratic Party site offered any response or any advice to voters on where to turn."

"With the extensive pre-election effort to prevent election fraud, including international observers, activist poll watchers and attempts to enforce paper trail backups, the Democratic Party’s silence on Ohio is puzzling," Nader stated.

Regardless of whether it changes the outcome, the release continues, the Democrats should follow through on their promise to make sure every vote counts in Ohio and other states discovering similar problems with electronic voting machines and other irregularities.

Other trouble spots exist in Ohio, including rules that allow officials to reject some of the 155,000 provisional ballots being cast in that state, Nader states.

Before Election Day, Blackwell, the Republican who co-chaired Bush’s statewide campaign, was challenged by voters-rights organizations for denying citizens their voting rights on the basis of a rule, later rescinded, requiring voter registration forms be printed on 80-pound paper stock.

Voter registration forms were submitted on newsprint in Cuyahoga County after being printed in the Cleveland Plain Dealer. Blackwell is also accused of trying to suppress the registration of poor and minority voters who most often vote Democrat.

"Our offices are being flooded with faxes and e-mails asking for assistance in resolving these irregularities - a lot of them are citizens who voted for you," Nader says in a direct challenge to Kerry and Edwards.

"In the spirit of good government, I urge you to make this effort now," Nader concluded.

Kerry, in Zeese’s mind, should be more direct.

"Kerry should say: ’I was serious about counting every vote," Zeese said. "’The reports of problems on Election Day raise serious questions that need to be fully reviewed. I am instructing my lawyers to provide support to those urging review of the vote count and my campaign is available to work in any way to make sure the vote count is accurate.’"

Nader drew roughly one percent of the vote nationally. He held a press conference last Wednesday and said he was speaking out for the "thousands" of American voters asking for recounts and not on his own behalf.

"Over 2,000 citizens including voting rights advocates are urging in writing the Nader Camejo campaign to help make sure every vote is counted and counted accurately," Nader remarked. "The Nader Camejo campaign does not view the election to be over merely because concession speeches, which have no legal effect, have been given. Rather they are over when every vote is counted and legally certified."

"Striking inconsistencies exist between the vote as reported on the AccuVote Diebold Machines and exit polls and voting trends in New Hampshire," he added. "These irregularities in the reported vote count favor president George W. Bush by five to 15 percent over what was expected."

"Problems in these electronic voting machines and optical scanners are being reported in machines in a variety of states," Nader said.

New Hampshire is about to become a test case for the accuracy of optical scan vote-counting machines because Nader has asked for a recount.

The request covers 11 of the state’s 126 precincts that use Diebold Inc.’s Accuvote optical scanning machines to count paper ballots. Depending on the results, his campaign could ask for recounts in other states, Zeese said Monday.

Nader doesn’t expect to change the outcome: In New Hampshire, Kerry defeated Bush, 50 percent to 49 percent, while Nader got less than 1 percent from the state’s 301 precincts.

Lawyers with John Kerry’s presidential campaign are gathering information from Ohio election boards about uncounted ballots and other unresolved issues from last week’s election, according to a Plain Dealer article published last Thursday.

Although Wade suggested a recount has no real chance of turning the election in Kerry’s favor, bloggers and liberal talk radio show hosts have speculated the senator was allowing grassroots candidates and campaigns to take up the fight so Kerry can appear statesmanlike and above the fray.

Conservative radio commentators, conversely, are dismissing the recount efforts.

"What we have here, ladies and gentlemen, are spam e-mail campaigns spreading conspiracy theories and rumors generating hard news investigations on the old media networks," Rush Limbaugh said during his radio program on November 12.

Others, however, have complained that the mainstream media have failed to cover the story adequately.

MSNBC’s Keith Olbermann has covered the story aggressively on his Countdown program, as have liberal radio talk show hosts on Air America.

"There has been a justifiable uproar about the major differences between the exit

polls in Ohio and Florida and the actual results," writes Sheldon Drobny, a CPA and venture capitalist and co-founder of Air America Radio.

"Democrats and Republicans, who both saw the same exit polls that showed an electoral landslide in favor of Kerry, have confirmed this," he continued. "It is important that people know how accurate random sampling of historical events can be in order for them to understand how unlikely it is that the exit polls were wrong."

"We have a Watergate story here that could give the media a post-election explosive news story that could make the 2000 Florida vote debacle look like small potatoes," Drobny concluded.

DeBar stressed a concession was not legally binding. He also believes a "Constitutional crisis" is about to erupt.

"What he should do is call a national press conference, recite each and every case of apparent fraud and or error that could bear on the outcome," DeBar said. "(Kerry) should remind voters strongly of the 2000 theft of Florida...he should redefine the results, and then redefine himself as someone worthy of challenging them. And he should go to the mat, both legally and politically."

"Call a million-voter rally in D.C, or, better, simultaneously in (New York), D.C, (Boston), L.A., (San Francisco), Cleveland, (Chicago), etc...Hey, maybe there really were only 51 (million) that voted for Kerry and 53 (million) that vote for Bush. Let’s see our 51 million in the streets. Better, let Bush and Cheney see ’em.".

http://www.northcountynews.com/view.asp?s=11-17-04/news5.htm

Forum posts

  • This article seems to imply that Kerry deserves some credit in the recount effort when he has done NOTHING to help. The American people demanded it...the Green Party supported US...and Kerry has been helping the media blackout by pretending that it isn’t happening. If Kerry were speaking up about the voting problems, the media would have no choice but to cover it.

    What a load of crap we are supposed to believe he is helping with his 17,000 lawyers. Why did the Green Party have to scrape together the funds for the recount when Kerry has been sitting on $51 million? Why the day after the story comes out on Democracy Now that Kerry has $51 million, they release a new news story saying that Kerry only has $15 million. Do they think we all have dyslexia? And $15 million is still plenty...when are you going to chip in Mr. trying to take credit, no action Kerry?

    Anyone else notice there are Kerry freepers going around trying to defend this Asshole when it is obvious he has thrown the election to his frat buddy Bush?

    • If Kerry were in the forefront of questioning what number of votes might have been stolen, discarded, or intentionally prevented (via mercilessly long waiting lines and insufficient voting machines in areas with certain political demographics), he would be getting hammered by the Bush administration as a sore loser who ought to be supporting our brave troops overseas instead of disputing the wisdom of American voters.

      Considering how long U.S. troops had been embedded in Iraq, was it sheer coincidence that all the military options and all the ground conditions came together to dictate that Bush order an all-out invasion of Fallujah in the exact time window of early November 2004 — just after Bush had declared his 51% "mandate" from the American voters, and before the widespread complaints about voting irregularities could be taken even half-seriously? It’s a fair question and I think Kerry is smart to have others ask it, instead of making himself a smear target for Bush.

    • How many lives in Iraq were lost because Hanoi Kerry was using Iraq as a way to win the presidency. Of course Bush had to wait until after the election to free Fallujah! If we had done it prior to the election, Kerry would have been on camera helping the enemy kill Americans like he did in Vietnam. America lost Vietnam because of traitors like Kerry helping the enemy. Go read the Communist General Giap’s biography. He credits victory in Vietnam to the American war protestors who gave their own men the resolve to keep killing Americans as a way to victory. Kerry is a traitor, just like the French that worked with the Germans in WW2.

    • we had no business being in Vietnam and we sure as hell have no business in Iraq. i say pull all the troops out and let bush send his daughters over there to fight. better yet let bush go over there since he didn’t have a chance to fight when it was his time.

    • I will say it again: Kerry is a traitor, just like the French that worked with the Germans in WW2. If this writer had his way, Hitler’s Nazi party would be ruling Europe, South Korea would be Communist, the Soviet Union would still exist, and Japan would still be raping women in China and Manchuria. Some people NEVER learn - we kill them BEFORE they kill us.

    • There would not be a recount if it weren’t for the Green party- so how can Kerry take ANY credit? He took all this money from everyday working Americans and not only didn’t spend it to win, he won’t help pay for the recount. This whole lying low theory is just plain stupid. Kerry is worried about the media? The media has no credibility so WHO cares? He has now lost all credibility with the American people who voted him into office- that seems more important to me.

    • Kerry has become an old man with no spine....he is really just another Republican and its good he did not take control of the government he is not up to the job. Let Bush stew in his own vomit he shit in his bed now let him lie in it.

    • Three in a row. Answering our own posts, are we?

    • So, Kerry is supposed to roll over because he fears more hammering by the GOP?

      I’m giving up on the Democratic Party, which invites the hammering because it won’t defend itself.

      If the Democratic Party won’t defend itself, why should we?

    • So true, I e-mailed the Democratic party 2 days ago and told them that I will go out with a sign on election day and stand there all day with my sign that says "As an eligible voter, I refuse to vote in elections that are phony", and I urge everyone who is pissed off as I am about 2000, and 2004 to do the same....to hell with the Democrats they do not deserve my vote. Of course I will never hear from them they are living in their ivory towers wearing their rose colored glasses thinking they have us all fooled.

    • Yeah, we have replaced all of those evil bastards with our Bush...and our marines who are over there sodomizing the Iraqi prisoners and raping the little boys, and murdering their citizens, starving their children, and claiming we are doing it for God.

    • You and your leader Bush both needs to get some clinical treatment from a Shrink. While you are delusional the latter is megalominiac.

    • So what are you doing? Waiting to see what happens? Waiting to see if some one else will go first? What are any of us whinning lefties doing..seen any demonstrations we can get into..organizing any? Except the one for the "Coronation in DC" I would go if I could..but it costs money and in case you haven’t noticed Bush is shoving the poor, working class poor, even furthur down..I just found out I will be laid off (again, and I was only making 8.00 an hour no benefits) on December 31, 2004...Merry Chistmas, sheeple...

    • Somebody please refer me to a news service report (not a Drudge report) of how many millions of dollars in campaign donations Kerry supposedly shorted his 2004 presidential campaign.

      Ideally, the report would also answer these questions:

      (1) Kerry has 20 years experience in government, where a rule of thumb is to spend ALL the money that is dedicated to your office or department. What happened in this case?

      (2) There seems no political or personal motive to explain the multi-million dollar underspending of donor money received by Kerry’s 2004 presidential campaign. Was any crime committed?

      Thanks if you can direct me to a news service report, not a weblog.

    • The AP news reports were dated November 19, 2004 and ran that day on the websites of most large newspapers.

      The unused contributions reportedly amount to $16 million in late donations that legally could not be spent under the federal funding cap placed on Kerry’s campaign after he was officially nominated as the Democratic candidate last summer. The money will likely go to the Democratic Party for future campaigns, but a portion of the money was earmarked for legal expenses in case a court challenge of voting irregularities were to be made, whether by the Bush campaign or the Kerry campaign.

  • Still can’t get over the fact that Bush won?

    • Bush stole, you mean. Look at the facts. There is a pattern of nationwide deception, but perhaps you’re not interested in statistical appercipience.

    • Exit polls, as with any other form of media are subject to bias from BOTH sides. The issue at stake is bigger than Bush or Kerry, bigger than Republicans or Democrats, it is a question of democracy, can we live with people who have different opinions.

      If we cannot do this we are doomed as a society, nationally and globally. The ideaology that there will come a day when there is no conflict is naive and would require turning a blind eye to the history of civilization.

      Democracy works because we are able to have a difference of opinion and still function, if we lose that ability we lose everything.

    • When Britain finally got rid of Thatcher after 17 years many thought Blair would be the democratic/Labour saviour. How wrong and how let down people feel. His policies are just a continuation of right wing destruction of public services, warmongering, and lying under a sickly Christian/Cliff Richard persona. When he was caught lying about the war/Saddam, he disappeared ’abroad’ for a few weeks and then we had the media with a succession of distraction themes getting us to look at ourselves -such as ’You’re too fat/eat the wrong food’, ’You drink too much’, ’You all smoke’, ’watch out there’s terrorists everywhere!’

      Its galling that the democratic process is shown up to be a sham and a fraud. OK, the most unlikely of scenarios-they concede there were voting irregularities, there’s a recount and John Kerry is president. So what would change ??? Absofuckinglutely NOTHING for the majority of Americans. As people have stated he was in the same Skull and Bones, the same Frat group, and now the same clique of millionaires. Maybe a few tax changes for the rich, maybe a few less troop deployments but generally exactly the same.

    • blah blah blah

    • I can’t get over the fact that an incompetent bozo like Bush can get more than 5% of the vote.

      And doing it merely by praying loudly and publicly!

      Maybe we do get the government we deserve.

    • Bellaciao alert!! Bellaciao alert!! The redneck that replies to every posting has awoken from his Budweiser slumberings....prepare for an intellectual onslaught.

    • I enjoy his capsule book reviews posted at all the big internet bookstores. The Democrat books he’s never read get a 0-star rating and the Republican books he’s never read get 5-star raves. By the way, the unread Bible he packs with his gun is the signed and numbered Neocon Press edition with handsome leather binding and a letter of authenticity signed by God and George W. Bush.

  • Bush won. Get over it Europe. America spoke. Europe should wake up. Keep ticking us off and the next time one of you invades the other, maybe we won’t come and rescue you AGAIN.

    • It’s not over till Cheney counts the electoral votes. Bush thinks he has a mandate. I don’t think he could get a mandate if he stood in Washington Square Park with only a pair of chaps on. So, don’t think it’s over until the fat guy sings.

    • oh...I’m so afraid you won’t come back to save us again...
      ah!ah!ah!
      how can you compare the brave american guys of WW2 with the neo-colonial, theocratic, violent and stupid war in Iraq ( daddy! daddy! ooooooiiiillll!!!! moneeeeeey! moneeeeeeey! ).

      America’s worldwide power is finished: that’s not a wish. It’s a fact.
      Learn to talk with the other peoples or keep on showing muscles and die soon buried under your own shit!

  • Kerry lost and lost big, you need to get over it and get on with your lives. We Republicans had to do the same in 1992 and 1996. I will add though that Democrats and liberals should get used to losing elections, because that is what you have been doing and will continue to do. The house has a 30 Republican lead, the Senate 10 and the white house for 4 more years (another 4 if Dems are foolish enough to nominate Hillary). Republicans have been winning elections and taking back this country since 1994 when the house became ours again.

    • Republicans took over in 1968, when that crook Nixon won a three-way election. The Republican platform then was to prosecute that awful, immoral Vietnam war. That interference in a civil war was intended to prop up yet another corrupt dictatorship. It cost the lives of 58,000 Americans and nearlly 2,000,000 Vietnamese, and accomplished exactly NOTHING.

      Carter won in 1976 only because that crook Ford pardoned that crook Nixon. If not for that, Ford would have been reelected.

      That crook Reagan won in 1980 by 1) Stealing Carter’s prep book before the debate, and 2) Illegally negotiating with the Iranians, getting them to agree to continue to hold the hostages as long as Carter remained in office, in exchange for giving them favors after getting in office. Treasonous!

      That crook Reagan won again in 1984, despite sponsoring terrorists in Central America, despite causing yet another Republican recession, despite putting a millenialist armageddonite in charge of the Interior Department. How? By thumping his chest. Oh yeah, and lying.

      Remember when Reagan’s whole administration was saying that Gorbachev was a phony and that the Soviet Union would never abandon communism?

      Remember when he said he’d catch the people who blew up the Marine barracks in Lebanon, killing 240 Marines?

      Remember when he said his tax cuts for the rich would stimulate the economy? Funny - the effect didn’t begin to show up until 14 years later, two years after Clinton took office.

      Remember when he didn’t lift a finger to fight AIDS? Didn’t even mention the word until the sixth year of his administration. Remember when one of his administration (I forget who) said, "Those people don’t vote for us anyway."?

      Here’s a guy who believes in astrology, but not in evolution. And he’s running the country! What an embarrassment.

      Then Clinton got elected. Unprecendented peace and prosperity for eight years. Crime down, abortion down, national debt down, incomes up, standard of living up, etc etc. All despite that silly-assed Starr investigation.

      That crook Bush "won" in 2000. But not really. Everyone knows that a full count of the votes in Florida would have given the state, and the presidency, to Gore. The Supreme Court, in a supremely disgraceful political decision, ordered the counting to cease.

      Too bad Gore was a woos - picking that dork Lieberman for veep, not allowing Clinton to campaign for him, failing to fight like Bush did for the election... The loss was as much Gore’s fault as anyone else’s.

      But one thing’s for sure - Gore would have read the memo "Bin Laden Determined to Attack Inside the US", and he would have done something about it, rather than spending the month afterward fishing, like Bush did.

      So now that crook Bush "wins" again. I can hardly contain my excitement.

    • What’s the Difference Who Won the Election

      Like our past involvement in Vietnam, our present engagement in Iraq presents similar depressing situations.

      Once again, we are perceived as an armed aggressor against a country who was not an imminent threat to our nation.

      Once again, we invaded a country in order to expand our corporate interests on foreign soil.

      Once again, many Americans grow weary of our entanglement and openly protest the war.

      Once again, a growing majority realize the reasons for going to war are replete with misconceptions.

      Once again, reports of abuse and deaths of prisoners continue to escalate.

      Once again, thousands of innocent civilians are killed by intentional bombing of villages suspected of harboring insurgents.

      Once again, draft age adults seek to emigrate to Canada.

      Once again, every day that passes, brings sad news to the families of those who proudly served their country.

      Our attempts to impose our form of democracy in Iraq will fail , as it did in Vietnam. When and if we leave, a government will emerge suited to the needs of their citizenry.

      There are very few differences between the quagmire that encircled us in Vietnam and the quicksand that engulfs us in Iraq.

      President Lyndon B. Johnson realized that his administration had fraudulently presented a scare scenario which was not supported by facts. He stepped aside and did not seek a second term. A new leadership negotiated a withdrawal from this failed endeavor.

      President George W. Bush is well aware that his advisors gave him false and misleading information. Ignoring their misjudgments and his conclusion, he sought and won a second term.

      As a nation we will face four more years of costly war in Iraq and the possible extension of our pre-emptive strike doctrine into Iran.

      Unlike the Vietnam conflict, where we never feared a direct attack on our homeland, the Iraq war has given new life to a fanatic group of zealots. This has caused an alarming fear of another terrorist attack within our borders.

      In an attempt to decrease our apprehensions, administration officials have expanded their invasive security powers and limited our access to due process.

      If our government acts like big brother watching us, in order to assure our safety, our constitutional freedoms will diminish.

      However, if our government acts like an older brother looking out for us, in order to maximize our safety, our constitutional freedoms will flourish.

      This is the difference between losing or winning the war against terrorism.

      Tony Mignone

    • Your commentary is "right in the pocket". It’s awesomely frustrating to know that the 2000 election was disgracefully stolen, and now the 2004 election is obviously reeking of foul play. Bush is the worst, most dangerous president in the history of this country.

  • Liberals and democrats are still holding on to some hope of a recount changing the election. The Republicans have spent too many years lying, cheating and bullying their way into power. Now that they have control of all branches of the government and a right wing media machine that smashes all opposition, do you really think they will give up the white house even if a recount proved that Kerry actually won, I doubt it. I didn’t want Bush to win, but I felt he would hold on to the white house some kind of way. I’m sure Karl Rove had a plan B, C and a D to keep the white house shit he probably have a plan to keep Bush in the white house beyond 2008. The Democrat Leadership is gutless and I’m just not putting too much hope into them, if the Democratic leadership is unable or unwilling to challenge these Right Wing Wackos that are running the country then I guess it’s up to us the citizen to take a stand, the 2nd straight ‘questionable’ presidential election, both time the democratic candidate just rolled over. Maybe we the people need to take it to the streets like the people of Ukraine. At least it will bring world wide attention to this situation.

  • If you see electionsmoking.blogspot.com you will see that evidences for fraud is pretty evident. I don’t think the election results can be overturned but we may be able to plug the future riggings conducted by the Republicans if we make enough noise.